Illinois vs. August Spies et al. trial transcript no. 1 Direct examination by Captain Black. Cross-examination by Mr. Grinnell. Testified through an interpreter. Testified on behalf of the Defense, Spies, August et al. Was the chairman at a meeting of the Carpenters' Union on May 3 which Louis Lingg also attended. Testified on various topics (page numbers provide a partial guide): Zepf's Hall (vol.M 372), eight-hour movement (vol.M 374), Carpenters' Union (vol.M 373), Lingg, Louis (vol.M 372).
Testimony of Ernst Niendorf (second appearance), 1886 Aug. 7.
Volume M, 372-375, 4 p.
Niendorf, Ernst.
Carpenter; German immigrant.
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[Image, Volume M, Page 372]
ERNST NIENDORF,
called on behalf of the defendants was examined in chief by Mr. Black and testified as follows.
Q- You were called as a witness by the other side in this case?
A- Yes sir.
Q- On the night of the 3rd. of May 1886 where were you?
A- I dont understand English.
Q- You understand well enough to answer that question% Where were you on the night of May 3rd.
A- Zeph's Hall.
Q- What were you doing there?
A- There was a carpenters meeting.
Q- You went in that meeting?
A- Yes.
Q- Did you occupy any position in it?
A- I don't understand.
Q- Were you chairman?
A- Yes.
Q- Were you there during the entire meeting?
A- I don't understand.
MR. BLACK: (To MR. Gauss) Mr. Gauss, will you interpret.
(Mr. Gauss here interprets)
A- Yes sir.
Mr. Black: Q- You have already testified Seliger was secretary at that meeting?
A- Yes.
Q- IN that meeting did you see Lingg, one of the defendants?
A- Yes.
Q- At what time and for how much of the time was Lingg there to your knowledge?
A- As far as I know he was there throughout
the meeting.
Q- What did lingg say during that nmeeting?
Objected to.
Mr. BLack: I want to show Lingg's connection with that meeting, that he was there making a report as a member of the committee at about nine o'clock--- that occupied about fifteen or twenty minutes, and that subsequently a motion came before the meeting and Lingg participated in the discussion.
The Court has there been any evidence on the part of the state to show where Lingg was on the night of the 3d?
Mr. Zeisler Nothing except Schaacks testimony that he said he had been at 54 West Lake street--- that must be a mistake.
Mr. BLACK: Zeph's Hall is corner of Desplaines 122 West Lake.
THE COURT: Where is 54?
MR. BLACK; Greiff's Hall.
THE COURT: How is that is there any testimony, a statement by Capt. Schaack that Lingg told him that he was at--
Mr. GRINNELL; At 54 West Lake Street.
THE COURT: Then it is admissible to show where in fact he was.
Mr. Black Q- You may go on now?
A- He made a report. He made a report as an organizer of the union.
Q- At what hour did he make that report.
A- About nine o'clock.
Q- How long did the report occupy?
A- About fifteen to twenty minutes.
Q- After that did Lingg say anything or do anything in the course of the meeting?
A- Yes, I gave him the floor two or three times thereafter during the meeting.
Q- Gave him the floor for what purpose?
A- It was in the discussion of the eight hour movement--- there was a comittee and executive committee appointed in reference to that strike and in this manner he spoke.
Q- How long did the meeting last?
A- Until after eleven o'clock.
Q- When did it commence?
A- At eight o'clock.
Q- Did you see Lingg before the meeting or after the meeting?
A- I don't remember that.
Q- Did Lingg go out of the meeting to your knowledge during the entire meeting?
A- Not that I know. As far as I know he did't leave the meeting.
Q- About what hour was it you last saw Lingg in the meeting?
A- It was shortly before the close of the meeting.
Cross examination by
Mr. Grinnell.
Q- How long have you known Lingg?
A- Since Last September.
Q- How often have you seen him between September and the 3d. of May
A- Almost at every meeting, everyweek once.
Q- How many men were in that meeting that Carpenters Union that night'?
A- About eight hundred to a thousand.
Q- Were they all sitting in chairs or on benches?
A- Some were standing.
Q- Was the hall pretty full?
A Yes.
Q- People coming and going?
A- Yes.
Q- Some noise and confusion?
A- No.
Q- Have you ever heard Lingg make a speech before?
A- Yes.
Q- Did you ever hear him make a speech in Lake View?
Objected to, Objection sustained.
Q- Do you know how far 122 West Lake street is from 54 West Lake?
A- That I can't tell precisely.
Q- You know both places do you not?
A- Yes.
Q- Did you ever have any conversation with Lingg about dynamite?
Objected to.
THE COURT. Is it not pertinent as showing the intimacy of the defendant with this man?
MR. ZEISLER: You put him on.
MR. GRINNELL: You have put him on just now. I proved a single thing by him. Now that he is on the stand I want to cross examine him.
The Court: I don't think it is competent to cross examine him now on matter collateral. He was a witness first produced by the State.